Gigi:
 Hello, friends, and welcome back. Today we’re going to be diving into something that I know many of us crave. It’s not just more freedom, but a life that actually feels like us, right? A lifestyle that actually reflects our passions and our deepest desires. 

Honestly, for me, that lifestyle has always included travel. Those of you who know me well know that. It’s not just vacations—I mean really going on travel adventures: soul-opening, deeply connected experiences. I love going to places I’ve never been to and meeting people who are new and interesting.

The great thing about my life is that I was able to incorporate that with my work. That’s the place where I really come alive. I’ve spent 40 years doing it—and will do it probably until I can’t get on a plane any longer. For me, that’s been such a huge part of my lifestyle.

So, for you, I want to ask a few questions to get you thinking, because I’m going to share in this podcast today the way I’ve created my lifestyle. As we’ve talked about on other podcasts, there are different seasons in life, so we have different ways of creating our lifestyle at different times. One question to start asking yourself as you listen is: What do I really, really want? And—so importantly—how do I want to live? What is that perfect lifestyle for me?

The truth is, we all have this lifestyle living inside of us. If you’re not fully immersed in yours, it’s like a vision, a dream. It’s something sitting inside us, this feeling that there is actually a rhythm that fits who we are. But what happens, I’ve found in working with tens of thousands of people over my career, is that we try to silence that desire because we convince ourselves maybe it’s too much, or it’s impractical. 

Often, I hear from people that it’s selfish—which, honestly, I think it’s more selfish not to go for what you want. The truth is, your dream lifestyle is your dream for a reason. It’s something that’s in you, and it’s trying to show you something. It’s trying to push you into the life you’re supposed to be living, the way you’re supposed to be living, the place that is in alignment for you.

As we go through this, I’m going to share different kinds of lifestyles, and maybe one of them resonates, or maybe you take bits and pieces from several. The first one is the adventure lifestyle. That is driven by movement, by discovery. It’s when you really use your curiosity, and it’s kind of that thrill of the unknown. 

It’s for the person who always has that bag half-packed—I think that’s me. Some dream of trekking through Patagonia, hiking, climbing mountains, living out of a van. That’s not me, those aren’t my dreams, but that’s for the person who’s more nature-focused and feels more at home in nature.

Again, whatever lifestyles we talk about here, you can absolutely take pieces of different ones and create your own. Then there would be the cultural traveler—not just about movement, but also about meaning. Meaning is important to them. Maybe they want to live in Paris for three months, or study the Japanese tea ceremony in Kyoto. I’d like to do that one, actually. Or learn Italian by living in a Tuscan village. It’s travel, but depth and education is what they really long for.

You can see, just from those two examples, you can start to really think about what’s something for you that you’d love to incorporate into your life and your lifestyle. For me, that dream has always involved travel and having unusual experiences. I’ve had a lot of different experiences in my life. I can feel myself lighting up as I talk about meeting interesting people, having clients I work with and friendships from around the world. That has been fun for me. I even went and lived in Europe for five years, in Amsterdam, and in many ways that life and that lifestyle resonated so deeply with me. It’s always hard for me in the US because I love having access to a city, the foot traffic, not having to get in a car, riding my bicycle everywhere. But again, there are different seasons in our lives, and there are times when we change.

I’ve been getting on planes since, goodness gracious, the early 1980s, and I’ve been flying for my business for 40 years now. Like I said earlier, I’ll probably do it until I just cannot do it anymore. When that day comes, I always say, hopefully, I’ll get myself a dog, and that dog will walk me and I’ll create a completely different lifestyle. That will be a different season in my life.

For you, it’s so important to see what are the elements of things that you love. Sometimes you see that through people you respect or people you know. Sometimes we see it through celebrities and think, “I’d love to live their life.” Often people think, “I can’t do that.” One of the main things people tell me is they want to travel. I hear that more than anything. 

Often, I’ve heard from people, “But it’s just so expensive.” Yes, it can be very expensive if you’re going to fly first class and stay in a five-star hotel every time. If you don’t have the means to do that, travel will feel out of reach. But there are so many different ways to travel.

Often, I loved going to cities, and for many years, people would bring me to a city—let’s say Munich, Germany, which is a place where I’ve done a lot of work and have many friendships and clients—and through my career I would stay with different people. Someone would introduce me, or if I was leading a workshop, someone would invite me to stay in their home. I wasn’t staying at a five-star hotel. Honestly, a lot of times, a coach ticket over to Europe—especially back in the day—can be almost less expensive than flying around the US. I think people just don’t think like that. They think of travel as vacationing. For me, honestly, I probably should have settled down more over the years, and some of my kids would definitely say so, but by design I chose a life of traveling and working in places I’d love to vacation in.

So, now it’s your turn. I want to give you some questions to start asking yourself: What really inspires you? I’m inspired by going to new and different places, not staying in the nicest hotel or a resort the whole time. That’s not what I want to do—I want to experience it. I want to get out and feel the people, the culture, and be part of the experience. It’s important for you to look at what inspires you. Maybe it is that you love five-star hotels—and I do love a good five-star hotel, don’t get me wrong—but it’s just not the way I would choose to travel all the time.

Another question is: What do you stand for? What’s important to you? What kind of people do you want to be around? How do you want to feel every day when you wake up? I think that’s a really important one because it’s about seeing what’s really important. Amsterdam really resonated with me because the water was there; I lived on a canal, I had the North Sea behind me, was up in a penthouse with a beautiful view. That was so important to me at that time in my life.

You have to see for yourself what you want life to look like. The most important thing is, like I said, how do you want life to feel? Here’s the bottom line: you get to choose, you get to design it. 

For years, people would ask me, “How did you design this life?” Back when my children were young, we would travel with them to Europe; they were homeschooled, so we’d spend three months in Europe, two months in Hawaii, and the rest of the time in Austin, Texas. People were shocked: “How do you do that?” It didn’t happen overnight. It happened by design, by planning, by looking at what we wanted at that time and how we could create it with our life and work.

This isn’t something that’s trendy or a new phase—it’s about really living that felt experience and having that day-to-day life experience that you love, or at least having aspects of it. Another example could be a very luxurious or elegant lifestyle. This is someone who feels very alive in a gown, walking into candlelit galas, sipping champagne with purpose-driven people, staying at beautiful hotels, hosting dinner parties, and living life like it’s an art. I like that one, too.

Then there are those who want a lifestyle that’s more rooted: to stay in one place, live more slowly, maybe grow their own food, have chickens in the yard, wake up in the mountains, watch the sunrise, be close to nature, and be very grounded and nourished, often with a focus on spirituality. That’s a very different kind of lifestyle. It’s really about how you wake up in the morning, what you see, what you hear, and even what you want to wear. Do you want to walk barefoot in the grass with your coffee, or sit in a café in a busy city?

I remember a woman I worked with a long time ago. She changed her lifestyle drastically—from being a city girl and very business-driven, she decided to have kids later in life, found some land, built a home, and had her kids there. She completely changed her life and her kids grew up in the country. She went back to her roots. So don’t get something in your mind that you can’t do it. If it’s something you’re longing for and it’s in you, it’s possible.

We often stop ourselves, but the truth is, if you ask yourself, “What does my soul want now?” or “What is it longing for now?” and also “What season am I in?” you may find opportunities. Do you have the flexibility to move to the country, to Paris, to change everything? Sometimes this can happen gradually. What kind of life will help you grow? 

For me, my path has been about growth and learning, and that’s why I love travel—because when I travel, I bring home those experiences.

There’s a passage I’ll read you from a book called Why Travel Matters by Craig Storti, which says it perfectly:

Tourism is largely to escape from, whereas true travel is arriving at.
Tourism is mainly recreational, while travel is primarily educational.
Tourists want to relax; travelers want to be stimulated.
The goal of tourism is to see the sights; the goal of travel is to add to understanding.

That distinction is everything. Travel for me is not about escaping—it’s about learning. I always learn so much and it makes me expand. I become a better person when I travel and have these experiences. He makes the distinction that real travel is not in your own country; it’s going to a foreign country, setting yourself up to be uncomfortable, experiencing a different culture, and sometimes being really humbled.

Not that I go to other cultures and pity them—I go with deep respect because so much of the time, I learn from them. I learn so much about their way of life, their food, their simplicity. It makes me a person with more depth.

If you love the more touristy way, that’s completely fine. That’s a choice. Travel brings me home to myself because I come back changed.

A few more ideas about lifestyles: a creative studio lifestyle—where someone’s life is around their art. They might have a loft, canvases, books, photography, and their days are spent expressing themselves and making art. Or it could be a spiritual or sacred lifestyle, with everything built around healing and stillness. Think about going to Bali: there are so many temples, morning meditations, yoga retreats, deep spiritual study, and creating a home that’s a peaceful sanctuary.

You probably hear things that sound interesting to you. 

Another thing I’d like to point out is that many clients have asked me through the years how I traveled so much with my kids and what’s a good way to do that. I love sharing this: when you want to travel with your kids, you can make travel part of your family culture. Choose a destination together, and give each child a role if they’re old enough. Someone can research the food, another the history, another the adventures. Suddenly, the family isn’t just on vacation—it’s a co-creative experience. Your kids aren’t just being entertained, they’re involved, interested, learning, seeing how to connect with the world. It’s a powerful way to have real experiences instead of just vacations.

You can have a family freedom lifestyle—maybe focused on quality time, conscious parenting, education through real life, homeschooling on the road, living abroad as a family. We lived in Amsterdam and also in Germany for several months because at that time, we really wanted to travel with our children, not just for work but to be there long enough to rent a place, experience life. Some of my kids would tell you: Mariah learned to ride her bike in Amsterdam at Vondelpark, and we were all on bikes. So many fun things.

I recently read the book Die with Zero, I don’t have the author’s name here. One thing that stuck with me is how he constantly talks about experiences. I have to tell you, I’m an experience junkie and that’s part of my lifestyle choice. The bottom line is: when we die, all we have to take with us are our memories. We can’t take our stuff, but in our later years, if we’ve used our time well—had experiences with our family and friends—we carry that with us. It shapes our identity, brings us joy, perspective, and meaning.

When you talk about designing your lifestyle, you also talk about designing the memories you want to make. What memories do you want to have? What feelings do you want to have later when you think about those memories?

My invitation for you today is to sit down and take a deep breath. Ask yourself: What do you really, really want? Where do you want to live? What kind of mornings do you want? What kind of people do you want around you? What experiences light up your soul? How do you want to feel every day? When you design your lifestyle from your heart, everything else—your business, your relationships, your purpose—will come alive because you are putting yourself in there. 

Maybe you want to wear silk robes every day. I was watching this 60s movie the other day, and Makena and I were laughing because the mother was in these feathery silk robes every day. We were laughing about how fun it would be to have those. But again, that’s a lifestyle choice.

Designing your life doesn’t mean you have to flip everything upside down tomorrow. It’s not about burning everything down, leaving your life, making some dramatic leap. It’s about starting to be aware and reconnecting with the truth of what you really want. As I said in the beginning: What is the lifestyle that sits in you? What’s the life you feel nudging at you, that you know you’re supposed to be living, but maybe you’ve lost yourself? All it takes is adding one little piece at a time, doing things that bring that out in you.

It can be as simple as planning a short trip to somewhere you’ve always wanted to visit, or maybe a place that really calls your spirit. 

Maybe it’s creating a vision board or journaling your ideal day if you don’t know what your lifestyle is. That’s what I recommend: start journaling every day, asking, “If I could live any kind of life, what would I do?” Prompt yourself with little questions each day and write, stream of consciousness—don’t edit yourself. Sometimes all it takes is booking a retreat, saying yes to an opportunity you’ve been hesitating about. Every little choice you make begins to create your lifestyle.

Here’s an interesting thing: Sometimes we think, “Oh, I want this life,” and as soon as we allow ourselves to try it out, we may see it’s actually not for us. That’s the powerful thing about starting to explore your lifestyle. Once you make aligned choices, it ripples through every part of your life. Your creativity will come back, your business will become more magnetic, your relationships will shift, and your nervous system will settle down the more that you have what’s right for you in your life.

For me, my lifestyle has been about travel and belonging on the road, not just in a place but to the world. I’m so blessed to have had the opportunity to travel so much and meet so many incredible people. I always say I belong to the world; I belong not just to my children, but to all children in the world. If I can be in service to people around the world, my contribution touches the lives of people everywhere. When I touch an adult, I naturally touch a child. 

That’s the truth that I live. I’m a bit of a gypsy—I say I carry that from my Czech heritage, from the roots in Moravia, from that gypsy soul—the good kind of gypsy, the one that seeks and sees and brings people together. That’s really what I’ve done through my life and career.

Again, maybe that’s not your path at all. Whatever your version is, claim it. Claim the lifestyle that matches you, because the world really needs more people out there living their lives, not more people doing a checklist. We need more people who are awake and in their purpose. When you do that, when you’re living the right life for you, you make a contribution just by being a role model.

A couple more lifestyles before I close. One could be the jet-set entrepreneur: she runs a business everywhere, bounces between cities, works out of coworking spaces. One week she’s in Lisbon, the other week in Cape Town, always meeting new people, scaling her business, with a trendy and flexible style.

Another is the community and connection lifestyle, built around shared living, intentional communities—you see more of that these days. Maybe a co-housing setup where there are regular dinner circles. It’s all about belonging, being part of a community, supporting each other, and collective growth. The blue zones—if you’ve seen or heard about the documentary—they studied all the blue zones around the world. It’s fascinating because they’re creating blue zones in the US now; there’s one outside Tucson, Arizona. That’s a lifestyle choice—communities designed a certain way, with specific eating habits, ways of moving, and connection.

Those are a lot of different ideas! 

So your takeaway today is to start asking those deeper questions and be honest about what lights you up. Stop apologizing for your dreams. Start designing a life that reflects your soul because you deserve it. More than that, the world needs you lit up. More lit-up people are going to do better things and heal this world.

Until we meet again, go live it, go dream it, go do it, and start your dream lifestyle now. Thank you so much for being here. Please share this if you know someone who is feeling a little down or doesn’t know what to do—maybe this can be an inspiration for them. Thank you, thank you.

Makena: Hello everyone!

Gigi: Hi Makena. Hi everyone. Thank you so much for tuning in.

Makena: Yeah, we have a different type of episode today because this one really came out of my own curiosity. I wanted to interview Gigi on the stages of life—the different seasons of life that women go through. 

Gigi, you’ve been through all of these stages. You’re in the wise woman stage, which we’ll share is the fourth stage. But not only have you gone through them yourself, you’ve also coached a lot of women at different stages of life. 

You’ve raised daughters who have gone through most of these stages. I think your unique perspective on the different seasons of life—what we go through, what you’d say to your younger self, or what advice you’d give to younger women—would be really fun to hear, for me and for our listeners.

Gigi: Yeah, me too. She came up with this and we invented it like this. If I had more time to think about it, it would be fleshed out much better. But I think it’s good. There will be certain little tips…

Makena: Here and there. We’ll just have a dialogue.

So, the stages we’re going to talk about today—there are four of them. The first one we’re going to call Maiden or Young Woman. That’s your 20s into early 30s. The second one we’re calling Queen, which is really kind of your prime—that’s around 33 to 43 or so. Then we have Alchemist, which is that midlife time of maybe 44 to 60. And then finally, Wise Woman, which is post-menopausal, or roughly 60+.

We’ll go into each of these. One thing to say first is that these are generalizations. Also, something Gigi brought up before we were recording: it really depends if you have kids or not, when you have children, and if you’re in a long-term relationship. So there are a lot of factors. We can’t take everything into account, but we’re going to share a general high-level look at each stage.

So let’s begin.

With Maiden or Young Woman, again—this is your 20s or early 30s. If you had the mic, which you do right now, to speak to women in this season of life, what advice would you give them? How can they make the most of this time?

Gigi: You know, the first thing that came to mind when you asked this was: have a lot of fun. This is your time. Your 20s and early 30s are when you’re just putting things together. So it’s a time to have so much fun. Learn things. Get out there and explore life. Try different things. Of course, you’ve got to earn. This is a time to explore your passions and do a lot of different things. You need to have a job or some way of earning money, but it is a time of exploration, curiosity, and adventure.

You have this time to start seeing: What do you like? What do you love doing?

Makena: What if someone—like me, I guess—ends up in a career that’s great, but it’s not really what they want to be doing, and they’re scared to make a change? I see a lot of people who follow a path they think they should, or what they studied in school. How does someone like that tap into the fun and exploration?

Gigi: It makes sense. I believe if you studied something in school and got a job—even if it’s not “it”—you’re learning something very valuable: how to stay committed to something. That builds a foundation for your work ethic. I think maybe the challenge is staying a little too long. So if you’re working at something and it’s not quite it, remember that you’re out there exploring.

The main thing is: create a life around your work. Enjoy your life. Take some of that money and start learning to invest. Find a mentor early on who teaches you about money—how to build it, invest, and save. It’s so important at an early age because we don’t learn that in school.

So, I’m not saying bounce around to a bunch of different jobs. I’m saying in your life, explore different things—dance, sing, whatever it is. Have a fun-filled life, not just a working life. That’s where you got a little serious for a while.

Makena: Mm, yeah. Be responsible. I had a lot of fun too and definitely traveled and explored, but I got very serious in my career and felt stuck. I think that’s what you’re saying—you’re young enough to pivot, try things, take risks, and even fail at this stage. You don’t have to get it all “right.” And to prioritize fun—especially if you think you want a partnership or family. If you have that time before a long-term relationship and kids, this is the time to be a little more carefree.

Gigi: Carefree is a great word. You can still be paying your bills and putting away some money, but it’s important to build a life around your work that includes adventure and enjoyment. That’s part of what this time in life is built for.

Makena: Are there any other challenges or pitfalls you see for women at this stage? Things you wish you could tell them?

Gigi: Don’t get stuck in relationships or jobs that don’t serve you. Maybe you have to stay for a while, but keep looking and go for something different. Don’t get stuck in fear. This is a time to be courageous—to do what scares you. You’re developing mentally and emotionally. Try different things and have confidence that life will work for you.

Makena: Yeah, I stayed stuck in a career for a while. I didn’t get stuck in relationships, but I see women who stay longer than needed—out of comfort, maybe. What do you want to say about that?

Gigi: If you want children, and you’re with a partner who doesn’t want children, that’s a non-negotiable. This is a critical time period. You may think you have time, but if someone doesn’t want a family and you do, you need to move on. There are other fish in the sea.

Makena: I’d add: don’t be afraid to have those conversations early on in dating. Be honest with yourself about what you want. I see a lot of young women say they’re flexible or undecided, and that’s okay if you’re in your early 20s. But we do have a biological clock, and it’s worth thinking about. If you are clear or can get clear, own what you want.

Otherwise, people wake up someday and go, “Wait, I really want a family.” And maybe they’re in a relationship with someone who doesn’t—or didn’t prioritize looking for a partner. I see a lot of women in their mid-to-late 30s struggle with this.

Makena: Yeah, definitely. So let’s talk about the next stage, which we’re calling the Queen or your prime. That’s approximately, let’s say, 33 to 43. I’m in this stage right now—smack dab in the middle of it. What advice would you give to women in this season? How can they make the most of this time?

Gigi: This is a time to build. I always say by 33, you want to be pretty much into something that you want to dig your heels into—put some work in and grow something. This is the time to really learn how to grow something, to be committed to something.

Now again, this is coming from me, and in many ways, I’m old school. These days, people don’t stay in jobs that long. But this doesn’t mean you have to stay in the same job forever—it means building in a direction. So when you get into your 40s, you’ve gathered enough experience to either build something new or take something deeper.

Many people go into their 40s and 50s and that’s when they really build their careers. Because they’ve been working at something, they’ve learned how to build, they know what they want—and what they don’t want.

So I’d say the biggest thing here is: build. Get focused. Even if it’s not “it,” go for it. Because in that process, you gain so much that will guide your next move. You’ll have gathered experience, confidence, and clarity.

Makena: Yeah, can you talk a little more about that—even if it’s not “it”? Because I think there are people at this point who have found a direction or path they want to build in. But a lot of people are still saying, “I don’t know,” or “I’m doing something, but I don’t think this is it.” What do you mean by “get in there and build even if it’s not it”?

Gigi: I think it’s really important, as I said, that by this age—33, 35—you commit to something and go for it for a few years. Unless you’re absolutely miserable and can’t do it, I really believe that when women do this, it gives them opportunity.

You learn what you want and what you don’t want. You learn how to make something move, how to grow something, how to have intent, how to commit. And then, by doing that, you can get clearer about what you do want.

In your late 30s and early 40s, it’s a powerful time to shift if you need to. But you’ll go into that shift with so much power and knowledge.

Makena: I have a couple of questions about that. One is: what’s the alternative? It’s someone who just continues to flit around, trying a bunch of different things, and never really committing to anything for more than a few months or a year. Like they’re still acting like they’re in their 20s and have all the time in the world.

And again, there’s no right or wrong here—we’re not judging. But if you want to build something long-term, at some point you need to get in there with intent, grow in something, build confidence and skills, and then you’ll have the foundation to evaluate: is this really it?

I guess my second question is about women who have children and take a break from work. We’ve talked about this in other podcast episodes—like the one we’ll link in the show notes about Babies or Business: Can I Really Have It All?

But how do you see that factor into this whole “building” time? Because a lot of women take time off in their 30s to raise kids. Is it just individual, or what do you see?

Gigi: Yeah, it’s tricky. I also believe women should start early on learning how to take care of themselves financially. If I could go back and talk to younger women, I would say the financial piece is huge—learning how to take care of yourself.

I wish we had more time and I had brought stats, but there are statistics that show when men and women get divorced, women’s lifestyles decrease enormously. So if you’re going to stay home, that’s great—but you need to figure out how you’ll be taken care of financially.

Yes, empowering your partner is one way, because you’re absolutely building with them by being their support. But I do feel that needs to be clearly set up—that you know how you’ll be taken care of if something happens.

The biggest pitfall I see is women thinking, “Oh, that would never happen to me.” And then we get into a conversation and I ask, “Are you taken care of?” And many times… they’re not.

Makena: And when you say “taken care of,” you mean if something happened—like a divorce—would they be financially secure?

Gigi: Exactly. Would you be financially supported?

Makena: Yeah. I think that’s a really important conversation—and one people don’t want to look at. They don’t want to think about it.

Gigi: Right.

Makena: So how do you walk women through that? Let’s say someone wants to take time off for many years—how do they approach this?

Gigi: First of all, know everything about your money situation. I find so many women say, “Well, I don’t really handle that,” or, “I’m not sure.” So my first piece of advice is: have business meetings with your partner every month. Know where everything is. Have access to every bank account. Be an equal partner. This is your business, if you’re going to stay home.

If your partner is the breadwinner, great—but you’re empowering that partnership. Don’t just turn it over and say, “Oh, they handle that.”

And have these conversations early on in your relationship. You’re a team. You’re running a business together, whatever their job is. And you’re both choosing for you to stay home.

Makena: That’s super interesting. This is one of the biggest pitfalls in marriages and partnerships, you’re saying?

Gigi: One of the biggest. And it even shows up for women who aren’t staying home.

Makena: Yeah, just not knowing what’s going on with the money.

Gigi: Exactly.

Makena: We didn’t expect the conversation to go here, but I think it’s incredibly valuable. And it’s not about making women afraid or telling them not to stay home—it’s about being conscious and having the conversations.

Gigi: Yes.

Makena: Not just assuming “it’ll all work out.”

Gigi: Because unfortunately, far too many women learn the hard way.

Makena: So if someone wants to take time off with kids, one option is to be super proactive and understand the finances, and the other option is to maybe stay connected to something—part-time work, freelance, learning something new. Keep your earning potential there.

Gigi: Yes. Even small projects where you earn a little—it doesn’t have to be a full-time career, but something that keeps your mind active and your skills sharp. It keeps your intelligence in that arena. I feel very strongly about that. Others may disagree, and that’s fine, but I’ve seen it over and over.

Makena: What else in your Queen era do you think is important?

Gigi: On the other side of things: some women are too focused on their career. They forget they want a partnership or children. They think they’ll do it later. They get addicted to success—or just addicted to work and the stress—and think they don’t have time.

That is baloney.

If you want a partner, it needs to be a top priority. If you’re in a successful career, you have to dedicate time every week and go after it. No excuses. You might have to kiss a lot of frogs before you find your prince.

But if you bring the same level of commitment to finding a partner that you bring to your career, you’ll find one. I’ve coached women all over the world through this.

The pitfall is thinking, “It’ll just happen someday.” If you’re busy and don’t make time, it might not happen. And if you really want that, you don’t want to regret it later.

Makena: Yeah, absolutely. Definitely.

Gigi: Another one is staying physically active. This is your time to really build community as well. Grow and build a community, so as you move into your 40s—especially if you have children—you’ll have people around you.

If you do have kids, you’re going to be busy with them and with your career or business. You want to have a community that will grow with you through your 40s, 50s, and beyond. Some people have connections through university or from growing up, and they stay close to those friends. But often, people don’t. And this is your time—especially when your kids are growing up—you can meet great people.

Those are the people to stay friends with. Stay friends with a lot of diverse people too. That would be another thing I’d say.

Makena: Yeah, because I think a lot of people—especially if they have kids—lose connection to people who aren’t in the same stage of life. So it’s important to keep some kind of link to different kinds of people. That can really add a lot of richness as you get older.

Gigi: It does. And you don’t know where those people will come back into your life. But if you don’t stay connected, you may end up with a narrow circle. You’re going to grow and evolve so much over the years—you won’t even recognize yourself 20 or 30 years from now.

Of course, parts of you will stay the same, but hopefully you evolve into better and better versions of yourself. That’s the proper way to grow.

Makena: Absolutely. Another area you touched on is health. That’s important in all decades of life, right?

Gigi: Yes, of course. In your 20s, you feel invincible.

Makena: Or less aware of your health. I don’t know—I’ve always prioritized health because I’ve had health challenges. But like, for my husband, he was one of those people who was just always healthy. His body just worked. He never had to think about it.

But as he’s gotten into his later 30s, it’s like—whoa—different things are breaking down, or not healing like they used to. And it’s a wake-up call: I’m not invincible.

Gigi: Yes. Not to generalize or gender-stereotype, but men often think that—they think they’re invincible.

Makena: Yep. So health and finances—those feel like two of the big through lines that, if you can start early and take even small steps, they really add up. Make a small investment. Start a retirement fund. Learn about nutrition or exercise.

Over the years, those little steps prevent bigger issues—or at least support you in navigating them.

Gigi: Yes, absolutely.

Makena: There was one more thing you wanted to touch on in this Queen stage, which is: if you’re already in a long-term relationship, what should you be focused on?

Gigi: Yes. This is a time where—especially if you have kids or you’re both building careers—people can start living separate lives a little bit. They’re just busy.

And there’s this myth that it’s normal. That it’ll work itself out. “We’ll get back to each other later.” But this is a very serious mistake.

It’s so important—especially as you approach your 40s—to reinvent your relationship. Put time and attention into growing it to the next level.

Because here’s what happens: kids come, or careers take over, and if you don’t find time together, you start growing apart. And sometimes it becomes very hard to come back together.

You feel like you don’t even know the person anymore. That’s when people start talking about a midlife crisis. They feel alone. They feel disconnected. And that’s when things break down.

There’s also a point where women hit around 43 and say, “This is my life. Is this the life I really want?” And often, women will leave their marriages during this time.

Makena: I see that too. So what you’re saying is: in your 30s and early 40s, start investing in your relationship so it’s strong going into that next phase.

Gigi: Yes. Instead of growing apart, you go through those challenging transitions together. You build a stronger muscle as a couple. You deepen your connection.

Makena: I see this especially with people who have kids. Their 30s and early 40s become all about the kids, and they just go, “We’ll have time later.” But like you said, it doesn’t always bounce back.

So it’s about being conscious—not just hoping it’ll work. Prioritize your relationship. Whether it’s your sex life or your communication—don’t let it slide for too long.

Gigi: Exactly. And when you prioritize your relationship, that means you make time for it. Not just a weekly date night—you’re attentive to your partner. You make quality time a priority.

If you have children, it’s also valuable for them to see that. It’s important for kids to see their parents spending time together away from them. And learning how to give their parents that space.

That’s great role-modeling for future relationships.

Makena: So now we’re kind of on the border between Queen and the next stage, which is the Alchemist—midlife, roughly 44 to 60.

Let’s talk about that. What advice would you give to women in that season of life?

Gigi: Take everything you’ve learned so far—and really build something. If you want to start your own thing, go for it. If you want to grow a strong marriage, go for it.

Everything you’ve learned—apply it now. This is some of the most powerful time in your life.

This is also when women go through menopause. And we’ll talk about that more later. But this is a time when you want to build your lifestyle.

You’ve probably had some success. If you have kids, they may be teenagers. Maybe not. But either way, it’s time to design how you want to live over the next 20 years.

What kind of lifestyle do you want? Bring in the elements you love. You know yourself so well at this point.

And just like in your 20s, make sure you’re still having fun. Set up a lifestyle with pleasure, rhythm, time off—something you really enjoy.

Makena: Yeah, it feels like the Queen stage is planting and watering seeds—and this Alchemist stage is the harvest.

Gigi: Yes. Exactly.

Makena: Let’s say you’re still raising your family at this stage—what should people be focusing on around family and relationship?

Gigi: I think creating your family structures. Not just with your kids, but with your parents, too. If your parents are older, how are you going to navigate that?

People don’t want to think about this—and then it hits them over the head. But if you think about it ahead of time, you’ll see options. And then it’s not a problem—it’s integrated into your life plan.

Makena: Can you say more about that? What are you asking women to face or look at?

Gigi: If you have aging parents, at some point you’ll probably need to support them. It depends on their health and circumstances. But it’s important to start asking: How would we handle that?

What do we do as a family? Do you have siblings? What’s the plan?

Because I’ve seen this become a huge issue in families. Nobody plans. Nobody talks. And then one sibling ends up with all the responsibility, or it becomes a conflict.

It doesn’t have to be that way. You can set it up with clear roles and plans—financial and otherwise. And then it becomes just part of life—not a crisis.

Makena: Yeah, so just being proactive, thinking ahead, having conversations with your parents, siblings, and your partner about how you’ll navigate things if your parents’ health declines or they need financial support.

Gigi: Yes. It’s not a fun conversation, but it’s so necessary. If you plan early, you avoid so much unnecessary pain and conflict later.

Makena: What else in this stage?

Gigi: If you’re in a relationship, again, make sure you continue to invest in it. And financially—make sure you’re setting up for retirement. Keep your eye on your finances. What are your savings like? What are your systems?

Start dreaming about retirement. Think ahead. You don’t have to wait until your 60s to think about how you want to live. Some people want to retire early. That’s great—but have you thought about how?

Makena: Absolutely. And now let’s talk about menopause, because that’s a big one for this stage. We did a whole podcast episode about it, which we’ll link in the show notes, but just at a high level—what do you see?

Gigi: Menopause is a time of change, and yes—it can be uncomfortable. There are physical aspects to it. But it’s also different for every single woman, so we can’t generalize.

In our other episode, we talked about how menopause has gotten a bad rap. Everything around it is framed negatively, and I don’t believe that’s how it should be.

It can be a pitfall if you let it take you off course. Some women start blaming everything on menopause—and while the changes are real, it can also become an excuse to avoid doing the deeper personal work.

This is a time of reflection. Around 42 to 45, people tend to ask: Is this the life I want? So menopause, in many ways, is part of that process. It’s a clearing out of what no longer serves you, and a welcoming in of who you’re becoming.

So I see it as an awakening—an opportunity to take all the power you’ve gathered and really ask: What do I want now?

Makena: I love that. Just reframing it. Yes, it can be intense. But it can also be a powerful transition.

Gigi: Exactly. You’re stepping into your power—into a deeper version of yourself.

Makena: So that’s one of the big pitfalls—blaming everything on menopause or not working through what’s underneath.

We also talked about the pitfall of not investing in your relationship at this stage—and of course, financial preparation is another big one. Making sure you’re still building or maintaining your earning power if you can, or that you’re set up long-term.

Gigi: Yes, those are the big ones I see over and over again.

Makena: So that takes us to the Wise Woman stage, which is the last of the stages we want to talk about here. This is really 60 onwards, and probably postmenopausal. What advice would you give to women in this season of life? How can they make the most of it?

Gigi: This is a time to do what you want—to live the life you’ve built. You don’t have the same kind of energy, maybe, but you have wisdom, you have intelligence, and you have a different way of being.

This stage is about being, not doing. It’s the shift from striving and pushing to really embodying who you are.

You have enormous life experience, and the greatest gift now is to share it. Whether that’s with your family, friends, or through your work.

I’m blessed to have my work where I get to use and share that wisdom. And this stage is also a time of reinvention—a time to look ahead and ask: How do I want to live the next 20 or 30 years?

Because you can become a completely new version of yourself. Maybe you raised your children. Maybe you’ve finished one career. Now you get to ask: What do I want now?

It’s almost like a time of play.

Makena: A second childhood?

Gigi: Yes! A return to another version of childhood. Some women become actresses in their 60s. Some become authors or start businesses. You can do anything.

But the distinction is: the energy is different. It’s no longer about making things happen physically. It’s about being, about using your energy intentionally.

Because if you stay in the same stressful pattern of your 30s and 40s, it will start to take a toll. Not because you’re weaker, but because your body and spirit are calling for something else.

Of course, you can still be strong and active—absolutely. But it takes more intentionality now.

Makena: Yeah. Hopefully, you’ve been prioritizing your health along the way, but it becomes a different focus at this stage.

Gigi: Yes.

Makena: Can you talk about the difference between women who age quickly versus those who keep a kind of youthfulness in this stage?

Gigi: For me, it’s always about aliveness. Are you doing the things you love? Are you staying curious?

This is the time to go back into adventure mode—learn new things, keep your brain active, move your body, stay engaged with life.

The people who say, “Well, I’m getting older, it’s all downhill from here,” tend to age faster—physically, mentally, and emotionally.

But the people who are constantly evolving, learning, growing—they stay young at heart.

Makena: Yeah, and I think there’s a narrative that after a certain point, you’ve lived your life and it’s all kind of the same or downhill. But we’re living to 80s, 90s, even 100 now. That’s decades of life.

Gigi: Yes! So don’t just let it go. Keep something that you care about. Keep something you’re learning, something you’re curious about.

That’s what keeps people young. Have something you love doing—gardening, dancing, painting, mentoring—whatever it is.

Makena: I think that’s such a key: even if it’s something simple, do what you love. Don’t just shrink your world down.

Gigi: Yes. And find ways to be in service too. That could be to your family or your community. That doesn’t mean overextending yourself—but it means sharing your wisdom. Be a mentor. Be someone people come to. Or start something new.

But always stay mentally and physically active. Those are the two keys here.

Makena: And hopefully, if you’ve been financially planning all along, this is a time to enjoy your life.

Gigi: Yes. And you can still earn money in this time too, if you want. Just like when I turned 60 and we started our mentorship—I was just beginning a new kind of career.

Makena: Yeah, you were turning 60 the year we officially started our mentorship, and I was turning 30. And since then, we’ve done so many projects like this podcast where you get to share your wisdom.

Gigi: Yes, and I don’t think I’ll ever fully retire in the traditional sense. Of course, I’ll shift how I work. But I want to stay mentally active—maybe writing books or dancing. Who knows?

Makena: She’s going to have a whole new career as a rock star in her 70s.

Gigi: Yes! The 70-year-old rock star!

Makena: All right, well thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with us. And thank you everyone for listening. If you have someone in your life you think would enjoy this or benefit from it—no matter what stage of life they’re in—please share it with them.

We’ll see you in the next episode.

Gigi: Thank you.

Makena: Thanks, Gigi.

Makena: Hello, everyone, and welcome back to Way of the Muse. I’m Makena and this is Gigi. We’re excited to be back with you all this week talking about a topic that I feel is very hot right now. I’ve been wanting to do this episode for a while, which is boundaries. 

How do you set boundaries in your personal life, in your work or professional life, and do that in such a way that it’s effective and not abrasive or something that might alienate people or disrupt your relationships? So that’s what we’re going to start with today. Gigi, do you want to say anything before we jump in?

Gigi: Yes, like you said, this is a topic that comes up a lot in coaching. When we work with people, we’re working with their relationships and all the different dynamics and arguments that are going on. Often I’ll have a client come to me and say they’re setting boundaries, and like you said, Makena, you can immediately feel this is not going to be pretty. They thought they were having issues before, but now when they set this boundary, it’s even more problematic because of where it’s coming from. I’m excited we’re talking about this today so people know there’s an approach to boundaries—it doesn’t have to be all or nothing.

Makena: Definitely. What we see a lot is something we call the “pendulum swing.” There are pendulum swings in all sorts of things, but if you imagine a pendulum going all the way from one side to the other, this is often what happens around boundaries. 

Usually, people who don’t have boundaries in place end up resentful or frustrated. That builds up, and then they might swing to the other side where every little transgression feels huge, and they overreact. So, they go from not really setting boundaries or letting people walk all over them to overly reacting.

Gigi: I’m so embarrassed because I see myself in this.

Makena: She was like, “Did you write this episode about me?” I said, “No, I didn’t even think about you.” But I guess it was a good self-reflection moment. We all have our areas, right? What ends up happening is this creates a lot of drama. 

Sometimes it can even damage relationships and people start cutting others out of their lives, saying, “Well, they can’t hold my boundaries so they’ve got to go.” There may occasionally be a time and place for that, but for the most part, there’s a way to approach this so you don’t have to go that far. That’s what we want for our listeners.

Gigi: Yes, and there’s actually kind of a problem with the word “boundary” because it has this energy attached to it—it implies there’s a wall between you and someone else. What we want to share first of all is that a better approach is boundaries are, first and foremost, about the standards you actually set for yourself. For me, this has been huge; Makena, you’ve taught me so much about really seeing what’s right for me. 

Sometimes I just don’t even look at that. It’s about being clear—what’s right for me, what’s wrong for me, what works and what doesn’t work in my world. When we live in accordance with the standards we set and communicate them clearly, boundaries become easy to uphold. It doesn’t have to have anger or forcefulness behind every time anyone does something; you don’t have to push back. The main thing about boundaries and setting up what works in relationships and communication is: how does it create more harmony? That’s what it does—you’re not nitpicking about the little things.

Makena: Yes, I think a huge misconception is that boundaries need to be dramatic or will always create a lot of conflict. The real reason for boundaries, like you’re saying, is actually to eliminate that. If things are clear and in place—like when I was in marketing and copywriting, every time there was an issue with a client and something wasn’t clear, I would look at whatever it was and write it into my contract for next time. I’d work with my lawyer to write in all the timelines, expectations, everything. Over the years, the contract became robust, not too crazy, but enough so everyone knew the expectation: I’ll deliver drafts by these dates, I expect a review by this date, and if it doesn’t happen, here’s what happens. I may need to prioritize other work. 

Over time, it made things clearer and there were fewer breakdowns, miscommunications, and frustrations. We’re not always going to do contracts that in-depth, but you can use contracts in your personal life as well as your professional life. Gigi’s here in California with me, and she has my dog Chloe on her lap—so cute! But yes, contracts help clarify things. Even if it’s just a verbal agreement, the result should be less frustration, less confusion, and, as you said, Gigi, more harmony.

Gigi: The bottom line is harmony and taking the push and pull out of things. All my clients listening know I have them write contracts with their kids, with everyone. In it, there’s accountability on both sides; it really sets up knowing what’s expected of everyone. 

Even with our children, things can get murky, but contracts teach them accountability—if they don’t keep their word, there are consequences. It’s just a great way to learn. In all my decades of coaching, when people start something and I ask if there’s a contract or something written, they say they’ll get around to it, but later, because they didn’t do it, things backfire. We never fully remember what was said. When money starts moving in a business, people forget parts of the agreement. It’s not that they’re bad people; it’s human nature. 

That’s why we have contracts: we put it in writing so there’s clarity, and then we can focus on good relationships and dynamics.

Makena: What do you think it is that makes people not want to put contracts in place? Even in professional situations, people skirt around it.

Gigi: That’s a good question. Maybe it’s about incurring the cost to get a lawyer and do a contract. But often you don’t need a full legal contract—just writing down the agreement, what the two people agreed to, signed, and thinking through what could come up. Previous experiences give you information—you learn what works and what doesn’t, correct as you go, and get good at seeing what serves both people. Another thing is assumption: we assume when we say and agree on something, the other person sees it the same way. But definitions differ. For example, integrity may mean something different to me than to someone else.

Makena: I like to imagine a six written on the sidewalk between you and someone else. They’re standing on the other side; you’re both seeing it, but one says it’s a six, the other says it’s a nine.

Gigi: Exactly.

Makena: You might not realize the other person sees it as a nine until much later. People interpret things differently; we want to think the best, but maybe people feel that if they put a contract in place, they’re doubting someone’s integrity. That’s not it at all. Contracts and agreements set everyone up for success, protect relationships, and prevent breakdowns.

Gigi: From my experience, most of the time contracts protect relationships. It’s not about trust, but having all questions answered. Otherwise, you spend time thinking, worrying, wondering if the other person will follow through. People waste so much time in their minds, fighting and worrying, and it can ruin businesses and cost millions.

Makena: Yes. The reason I’m so boundaried—though it’s still a growth area for you, as you say—is really because you’ve taught me so much. When I had a big contract, I spent weeks negotiating upfront. Yes, I worried that maybe I’d lose the contract, but it was important because later, I had the contract to reference and it saved me a messy situation. We’re talking a lot about business contracts, but you can do this even in your personal life. Just write out your agreements with someone and sign it. It’s about the spirit of it, both having a copy, not necessarily the legally binding nature.

Gigi: Yes, sometimes people want to go back and change their minds, and that’s fine if you’ve written it in the contract that you’ll revisit it at a certain time. It’s so worth thinking these things through to save yourself time, pain, money, emotional stress, drama, and relationships.

Makena: I think another reason people don’t do this is they’re moving quickly and don’t want to think through things upfront. But, as you say, it saves so much time and energy in the long run. I want to come back to your point that boundaries are standards we set for ourselves. Let’s give examples. Maybe you never check work emails on weekends. Over time, even if company culture is different, people come to know that’s your standard. You might have an autoresponder that says you’ll reply Monday. That’s a standard you uphold for yourself. 

Another version: someone who doesn’t gossip. People might try to have those conversations, but you just don’t engage, and over time, people realize not to bring up gossip around you. You don’t have to make a big deal out of it. People see how you operate through your behavior. 

Third example: you only commit to something if you have the bandwidth and will follow through. Many of us say yes when we mean no. When you step back and check in first, people see you as reliable and someone who keeps their word. So those are a few examples.

Gigi: I love those examples. You probably want to know: how can I identify where I need to set better boundaries? Many people really don’t know. Some ways you can do that: are there places where you’re saying yes and you mean no? Or start to look at where you feel resentful or frustrated on a regular basis. 

I’ve defined certain areas for myself and cleaned them up by asking, “What am I tolerating that I don’t want to anymore?” My coach once asked, “Where do you need to say, ‘That’s enough?'” Also, look at where you feel like you’re giving more than receiving. These are great places to discover where you might need boundaries.

Makena: Great questions. Where are you saying yes when you want to say no, or giving more than you receive? We’re not going to go deep into the why—yes, maybe you want to explore that, but here we’re talking about how to shift it. Where is it showing up, and how can you make a shift? 

So don’t analyze why you’re a people pleaser—just look at where it’s happening and pick one or two things to start. Some common scenarios where boundaries might be needed: at work, saying yes to projects even though you’re too busy, ending up frustrated or burned out, which doesn’t serve you or the company. 

Stepping back, look at your bandwidth and say, “I can’t do it all—what are the priorities?” That’s a good way to approach your boss. With clients, coaches get frustrated with clients who cancel last minute, contact them outside business hours, or ask for more than agreed—scope creep. At some point, that doesn’t feel good anymore. These are examples where better boundaries are needed with clients. What about personally, Gigi, like with friends?

Gigi: Being late all the time is a big one—if your friends run late or cancel last minute, and for you, time is super important, that can be tough. You might have a conscious conversation: “I value your time and mine—if you can’t make it, please text me or let me know ahead.” And ask them to be on time. Or, you could add humor: some friends are always late, so you say, “I’ll show up 30 minutes late since you always run late.” There are light ways to handle it, too.

Makena: You have to see what works for you. What are other boundary scenarios?

Gigi: With team members, not following through on commitments is common. It creates frustration in a team if one person doesn’t pull their weight. It’s important to acknowledge commitments and ask, “Can you do this? If not, what do we do?” Maybe they need support, but it has to be addressed, not just let frustration build. 

In relationships, your partner might not help with household responsibilities, so you have to talk about what support you want or your expectations. Or, a partner not following through on something they agreed to. These little frustrations build up a lot. Really, what we’re talking about is not necessarily boundary violations but maybe you haven’t set or communicated the boundary yet. We’ll talk about how to do that next. 

So, pause the podcast, write those down, or think about your top one or two areas to work on. Now, the question is: how can you communicate your boundaries to others in a healthy way?

Gigi: To get clear about what you want, you have to ask yourself honest questions. If you were truly honest about your needs, what would you ask for? Where does the frustration come from? What would you ask for if you trusted people would respect and love you? Maybe you’re worried that asking will drive people away or cause conflict. What are you afraid will happen if you set the boundary? I think it’s important to look into your fear. Like you said, when you put it into a contract and were specific ahead of time, you worried you might not get the job, right?

Makena: Yes, definitely. There was always a chance they would say I was being too upfront or difficult. I wasn’t trying to be difficult—I just needed clarity. I wasn’t asking for anything over the top, just making sure things were clear. Sure, in the back of my mind I worried maybe they’d walk away, but with enough money and time involved, it was worth it.

Gigi: You have to be willing to take that risk, because when people don’t do this, it ends up a mess.

Makena: Absolutely. The other big one, after you get clear on what you want, is never complain and never explain. Gigi, you taught me this. When communicating a boundary or a request, don’t start by complaining about past issues. 

For instance, don’t go to your partner and list all the ways they’ve failed—it’s not the way to start the conversation. Ideally, you just say, “Hey, I’ve been thinking about this, and I’d love to make a request. Could you take out the trash once a week?” 

That’s more of a request than a boundary, but if they’d agreed and hadn’t been doing it, you might say, “I noticed that hasn’t been happening, is there something else we could do to ensure it gets done?” There’s no complaining, just stating facts, not pointing fingers or over-explaining—just stating, “Here’s what we agreed, it hasn’t been happening, what can we do?” Is there anything you want to add, Gigi?

Gigi: This is really difficult. It’s so hard to do.

Makena: Yes.

Gigi: When we’re personally connected with people, have history and communication patterns, it’s so easy to go unconscious and just complain—“You never do this!” and then list everything else they haven’t done. Then ask for what you want, but now the person’s defensive.

Makena: Exactly.

Gigi: I get it—I make this mistake all the time. With a little finesse and time, learning artful communication will save you time and energy. But in the beginning, it feels frustrating and time-consuming.

Makena: That’s so much of what we work with clients on—not just boundaries, but communication in their personal and professional lives. This is really your genius, Gigi, and a lot of what you’ve taught me: how to have conversations in a neutral, collaborative, non-combative way. It’s about inviting them to help find solutions. 

At a high level, that’s easy to say, but it’s nuanced when you actually do it. Just starting with not complaining and not over-explaining are great rules to remember. If you nitpick, people tune out. Easier said than done.

Gigi: And don’t over-explain! I work with clients on this all the time. Don’t go in and explain yourself—just share what you want, very clearly. Fewer words are better. People feel bad and think they have to explain, but it makes everything murkier. Clear communication is usually acknowledgment, request, and stating what you said. Work it out together.

Makena: So, we’ve talked about finding where you need better boundaries and how to communicate those boundaries healthily. 

The last question is: What if other people don’t respect my boundaries after I’ve set them? Gigi and I were just talking about this before recording. This is where agreements or contracts come in, even if they’re just verbal. If there’s a recurring breakdown, step back and have the conversation or put an agreement in place. 

The agreement should cover what you’re both agreeing to and, if it doesn’t happen, what’s the consequence? These don’t have to be huge ultimatums—there can be incremental consequences. Maybe the first time it happens, you agree on one thing, if it happens again, there’s another consequence, and so on. 

For example, in business, if an employee is written up three times, then they’re fired. Basically, incremental consequences can be agreed upon, so there’s no need for drama—you just state, “Here’s the consequence we discussed.” Does that cover it, Gigi?

Gigi: Yes. I’ve had many times with clients in work settings, and one way I suggest is to go to the person and say, “This isn’t working, what do you think the consequence should be?” It’s great because it lets them step into your shoes. 

You can even ask, “If it was you in my position, how would you handle it?” It gives people a different perspective instead of feeling attacked. Sometimes, kids come up with much stricter consequences than parents would, but it makes people start to think. For children, it teaches them to think in this way.

Makena: You may not do a contract with everything. If you’re talking about your partner taking out the trash, maybe you don’t have a contract, but you might sit down and write out all the household responsibilities, just to make it clear. If breakdowns keep happening, look at why, and use a collaborative approach: “Do you just forget? Are you super busy? Do you hate taking out the trash?” 

Understand where they’re coming from. Instead of complaining or blaming, say, “What’s going on?” Maybe they just forget, so you could suggest, “Should we set an alarm to remind you?” Collaboration instead of frustration or ultimatums.

Gigi: People are busy. Intentions are good, but they forget. With couples, even with the best intentions, they forget what was decided. So, simple things like making a list of household responsibilities and putting it on the fridge, with names by the duties. It helps—people see it and remember. Often, it’s not intentional, but without the reminder, they forget.

Makena: Absolutely.

Gigi: That sums it up.

Makena: Some common mistakes with boundaries: not keeping your word with yourself first. If you and your partner set up agreements but you don’t hold up your side, they’re likely not to either. Also, if a boundary is crossed, you need to uphold the consequence or broach the conversation. People get resentful and let it build up until it erupts. 

Step up: have the hard conversations, refer to agreements, and, if necessary, enforce policies—like reminding a coaching client of the cancellation policy. You can make exceptions, but be clear about the boundary. The mistake is letting people walk all over you. What are some other mistakes, Gigi?

Gigi: Another is thinking you have to make huge ultimatums, sweeping changes, or eliminate people from your life. Instead of being prepared and making agreements, people get upset and frustrated when others don’t follow boundaries, but don’t set up consequences to avoid drama. Then, always creating drama—delivering your frustration so forcefully that it creates defensiveness or blame, and not simply asking for what you want. Acknowledge, state what you agreed on, and ask, “How can we make this work in the future?”

Makena: Absolutely. To tie it all up: pick one area to start—you don’t have to tackle everything at once. Find one area you feel resentful, frustrated, or like you’re saying yes when you mean no. Ask yourself, is there anything I need to change in my own behavior? Get clear on what you want. Communicate, put agreements or consequences in place. Remember, you are training people how to treat you. If everyone crosses your boundaries, ask yourself if you’ve been clear, asked for what you want, and upheld your side of the agreements. Over time, you train people by keeping your word with yourself and with them.

Gigi: Yes, this is a meaty topic.

Makena: It is! If you have any questions, you can always reach out to us at support@wayofthemuse.com. If you know someone who would find value in this episode, please share it. That’s how we spread the word about this podcast. This is a powerful topic that can make a huge difference for you and those in your life. Thank you.

Gigi: Thank you, Makena. If you really liked this episode, please like it and give us stars on the podcast. We’d love for other people to see your feedback and share it with even more people.

Makena: Yes, ratings, reviews, shares—it’s all helpful. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Gigi: See you next time.